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 Post subject: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:04 pm • # 1 
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I love ultralight, which is why my baitcasting setup gathers dust. When people started talking about bait finesse systems (BFS) it really got my curiosity up. Unfortunately the price of BFS reels can make your wallet ultralight. Just too steep to see whether or not it was for me.

Then I started watching videos by YouTubers “BCSG” and “The Reel Test” and they were speaking well of an entry level BFS reel that was only $57, the Tsurinoya XF-50. It doesn’t go down to 1/16 oz like the high end Shimano and Daiwas but handles 1/8 oz lures just fine. I ordered the reel along with a rod that BCSG also recommended.

On Sunday, I spent an hour or so practice casting with a 1/8 oz weight in a field. Far fewer birds nests than expected. Chris Stewart’s tip of pulling out about as much line as you expect to cast and then placing a piece of tape on the line still on the spool was a great help. It limits how deep a birds nest can go.

Today I went out to my local pond, tied on a jig, and on my second cast I hooked a bass, only to loose it. Bummer, would have been a great story, I thought to myself.

No reason to be disappointed because the third cast produced another bite but this one I brought in.

I’m really enjoying the baitcaster experience. One thing I did was order the reel in left hand retrieve. I don’t switch hands after casting a spin or fly rod, so why do it with a baitcaster?

A high end Japanese BFS reel may be in my future but for now I’ll develop my skills with the bargain setup.

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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2018 10:11 pm • # 2 
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Following you here, looking into a BFS setup also!


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 8:04 pm • # 3 
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BFS Day Two

Got home from work early enough to get in some fishing time. As has been the pattern, the weather was still cold and blustery. We’re into our second week of April but afternoon temps remain in the 40’s.

The BFS rig had a jig with curly tail grub attached so I started with that. Maybe five or six casts in I hooked up with a hard fighting largemouth (at least for 40 something degree water). Yes! Soon after I was pulling hard against another, only to watch it come off the hook a rods length from the bank. IMHO these skirted jigs, even relatively light ones, have hooks that are much too thick, preventing a deep hook set with an UL baitcast rod designed for 3-8# line. After that there was nothing for an hour plus.

Eventually switched to a 1/8 oz jig hook (much lighter wire) and put on a 3” curly tail grub. I know both bass and perch will hit that. Took a bit to figure out the perch but managed several, most good sized. Also landed a bass which I expected to be similar to the first, only to discover it was long, thin and had some sores. Amazed that this old, sick fish fought so well.

Casting was into the wind and I was having a hard time with birds nests. Must have had at least 10 but each could be picked apart. It will probably be a long time before I’m ready to spool the reel with braid.

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Last edited by Knotty on Sun Apr 22, 2018 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Tue Apr 10, 2018 10:03 pm • # 4 
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You need to slow down, you're having just entirely too much fun for this early in the spring. ;)

Larry


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:46 am • # 5 
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Day 3 produced only 1 perch but I did realize my casting flaw. I was reverting to old spinning habits of whipping the rod to get the lure out there. Not good on an UL baitcast with no centrifugal brakes.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 8:52 pm • # 6 
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I may have to look at those reels. I prefer a baitcaster to a spinning reel, but I don't have anything in the baitcasters that will go that light.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2018 10:06 pm • # 7 
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Here’s a review by BCSG of the setup I have.

https://youtu.be/L6PI2rswfl0


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 7:54 am • # 8 
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No more internet at home, so I can't get on here much. Glad to see you enjoying the BFS rig. Don't know if you're aware of this method, but a great way to clear backlashes is to tighten the drag, press down hard on the line where it comes off the spool, and crank a few turns on the handle. Then freespool it and pull the mess free. It works about 90% of the time, and is great for the bad ones that take forever to clear the old way. Just DON'T FORGET to loosen the drag before you make the next cast.

Don't ask..........


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:21 pm • # 9 
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Thanks hipshot. Will give that a try.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:56 am • # 10 
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With temps in the 50’s I broke out the kayak, for the first time this year, and fished a private community lake. Wind was supposed to be 5-10 mph but ended up mostly at that upper number with some stronger gusts.

Brought my BFS outfit, a fly rod and a telescopic UL spin rig but only the BFS saw any action. I don’t know how fish pattern on this lake yet and moving around with a Strike King Bitsy Bug 1/8 oz mini jig w. a curly tail grub trailer produced no results for maybe 45 minutes. Then I noticed a yard, on a secondary point, with a large tree that had been blown over by one of the winter nor’easters into the lake. Thought that big piece of structure might hold some fish. After a few casts I was just swimming my jig back at the end of a retrieve when it gets hammered by a good sized pickerel. Other casts in the general area would get bumped, telling me more fish were around. After bumps I’d repeat the cast to see if it would get hit again, which it did twice, resulting in 3 nice snot rockets before things went quiet again.

Met up with a young guy who lives on the lake and we tried multiple areas w/o success until we got to the top of the lake. He was casting small crankbaits on UL and got skunked. I started to get bumps again but this time they were from largemouth and I caught 3. However I lost almost twice as many, some even after a deep bend in the rod and lots of reeling. I can’t figure out if the problem is the weed guard or the hook. I think Strike King uses an overly stout hook for a 1/8 jig. In some cases it seemed like the jig just popped out when the bass finally opened its mouth, like the hook had never penetrated. You can’t really bass set a hook with an UL rig, even a baitcaster.

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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:21 pm • # 11 
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Knotty, what line are you using?


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2018 11:53 am • # 12 
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hipshot wrote:
Knotty, what line are you using?


My rod is rated for 3-8# and I’m using Yo-Zuri Hybrid 8#. What’s your thinking hipshot?

At some point I may change to braid + leader for more sensitivity and less stretch but for now I’m playing is safe w. copolymer because of birds nests. Though I am doing pretty well at avoiding them now.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 9:50 am • # 13 
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Sorry for the delay: no internet service at home. I was wondering if your line was up to the hooksets with that Bitsy Bug; 8# should be more than enough. I am using 4# mono and have some difficulty with Texas rigs; the Gamakatsu EWGs (#4) work best for me but hooksets with a skinhooked Texas rig are iffy. Pretty much everything else is a reliable hookset with thin, sharp hooks. I doubt I could use that Bitsy Bug with 4# line.

I know some people like braid on levelwinds, but I'm not one of them. I used it for crankbaits, Carolina rigs, and spoon jigging on my levelwinds back when I did a lot of bass fishing, but I much prefer the way monofilament casts on levelwinds. I think you are on the right track with copolymer; it has less stretch than monofilament, but more than braid. You get more reliable hooksets but still a little bit of shock absorbtion. That's why I started with 6# fluorocarbon for those deep specks. I think that for the fishing you are doing, 4# would be the lower feasible limit on a levelwind unless you use tiny hooks. I may be wrong, but that's what I'm finding so far.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:32 pm • # 14 
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Agreed hipshot. I’ll probably stick with between 6 & 8# for this BFS setup. Not casting anything 1/16 oz or less, so no real need for lighter line.

I’m going to look into finding jigs w. lighter wire hooks or probably start tying up my own. Was in the kayak again today and lost more bass than I was able to bring to hand.

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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 8:25 am • # 15 
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Knotty, it’s not a surprise that you might be having problems with that “budget BFS” reel.

From what I remember i emails with Brian Chan (of BCSG fame) he really doesn’t consider the reel you are using is a “true BFS” reel.

I have fished UL for over 40 years, pretty much all UL for over 30, from fly to spinning.

I have outfitted some 1970’s and 1990’s Abu 1500’s and 2500’s to consistently handle down to 1/16 oz. crappie jigs. But when A few years back I noticed BFS tackle an$ then when I found BCSG on YouTube, I wound up buying several true BFS reels and rods. I currently have a couple Shimano Aldebaran reels, a Daiwa SS Air and a Abu BFS 7 reel.

From what I’ve got from some people in Europe and Asia, the reel you picked up perhaps isn’t the best reel? (Sorry, for some reason I have trouble with the name, with remembering how to spell it) Also, I was under the impression that the reel has centrifugal brakes?

I am disabled so I can’t afford a lot of expensive reels, but I “converted” some unused of my older tackle into cash to purchase these rather expensive reels, but am very, very happy with them.

Anyway, from your pics, it looks like you’ve got the top budget BFS bass rod, the Kuying Teton 6.5 rod?

For me, the best UL jig I’ve used to date has been the Keitech Mono Spin Jig, with an appropriate sized trailer. It worked for UL bass spinning and has carried over to BFS work as well. The hook is of fine wire and hook sets are more a tradional UL sweep and haven’t failed me yet. Plus I really don’t like the Bitsy Bug - to me it’s not a finesse hook on it, far, far too big and out of the package dull, most bass fisherman use it with a trailer weighing over 1/4 oz so it can be cast on what a lot of anglers consider their “light rig” a medium action rod or heavier.

As to lines, even in pretty rough areas, which for me in my locale are rock an$ some brush, I still never go below a good JDM 6 lb line. If I was to fish really bad areas, as I understand Japanese bass angler often do with their BFS reels, I’d follow their lead with a shipovk leader or topshot, whatever you wish to call it, of up to 10 lb. test, for abrasion resistance. IMO, reduce your line weight to at most a six lb test, quality line, casting will most likely be much easier.

Keep experimenting and you’ll get just as obsessed with UL baitcasting as UL spinning and UL fly fishing.

Now, using BFS/UL baitcasting for stream trout and/or saltwater fishing is just as fun and productive, but is just a little bit different, but not too much.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Fri Apr 27, 2018 6:05 pm • # 16 
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Thanks for the input waterone.

To clarify, I can't say that I'm having any problems with the reel. The Tsurinoya XF-50 does just fine in the 1/8 oz plus range. Birds nest and such almost always come when my form is bad, whipping the rod and such, which the magnetic brakes can't protect me from. No centrifugal brakes.

I consider the XF-50 a "gateway reel". Not true BFS, since it doesn't do 1/16 oz well, and I knew that going in, but close enough that I could get a feel for whether or not I'd like BFS and the answer is a resounding "YES".

My biggest problems are with the absurdly heavy hook in the Bitsy Bug. The only thing finesse about it is the weight and size. From the little time I've spent on bass forums it seems like those guys don't like anything that isn't stout and I guess Strike King marketing knows this, even though it doesn't make sense. They're so concerned about bending out hooks ignoring the fact that 6# line is the real limiting factor.

Also, correct on the rod, a Kuyung Teton 1.98m / 6.5'.

I chose the Yo-Zuri Hybrid line after reading very positive reviews from the bass world.

Thus far I'm only using this setup for still water fishing. Maybe when my casting skills improve I'll try it on rivers.

Thanks again.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:52 am • # 17 
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Knotty, I apologize for assuming that the reel had centrifugal brakes.

I texted a Brit friend of fine whose trying out one of the Tsurinoya XF-50 reels and he informed me that to him, even though it has magnetic brakes, his are very much an and “either off or on” type of brake, which seems to might be a bit problematic for a reel designed for light lures. In my experience, trying a lighter line might or might not help.

I’d not be too hard on yourself, as casting a very light lure with only spool tension is pretty iffy.

BTW, even though it’s not about BFS as the book was published in the late 1940’s, there is some good lightweight casting content in Charles K. Fox’s book, Advanced Baitcasting. Yep the same Fox of Letort fame. He and several friends had a major impact on fly fishing in the US. So being a baitcaster isn’t so heretical as it might seem for a UL Fly Fishing site.

As to the Bitsy Bug, it is more of a flipping jig than a finesse jig, but is far, far more available than any other smallish jig.


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 9:41 am • # 18 
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No problem waterone. I'm enjoying the exchange.

I have to disagree with the friend who said the magnetic brakes are either off or on. I adjust them over quite a range, depending on the situation, and can notice the differences. The link below puts you at a point in BCSG's YouTube where he talks about the brakes and surprises himself that the XF-50 can even cast a 2.24g (btw. 1/16 & 3/32 oz.) pins minnow with the right brake adjustment.

https://youtu.be/L6PI2rswfl0?t=22m58s


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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Mon May 21, 2018 5:51 pm • # 19 
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The lilly pads are coming up but not full sized yet, so BFS with 8# still works. Texas rigged a Zoom Finesse Worm on a size 2 EWG and added a 1/16 bullet weight. Light enough to stay off the shallow bottom w/o having to work it too fast. The bass and pickerel loved it and so did I.

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 Post subject: Re: Giving BFS a Try
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2018 9:51 pm • # 20 
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Kayak fished a local lake Friday night and struggled to get a bite. Then all of a sudden the bite turned on and I was hooking bass, pickerel and big sunnies regularly. This guy, the best of the night, was caught on a 3 gram jighead with a curly tail grub.

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