It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 5:33 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




  Page 1 of 1   [ 7 posts ] New Topic Add Reply
Author Message
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:11 am • # 1 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
I like solid carbon: it's ultra-thin, ultralight and consent to beyond the limits that conventional tube rods has. And it's even **** cheap.

These are the results of different solutions that I tried, and I find they are the more "clean".
I bought:
A) tip solid carbon 0,8mm tip, 2,4mm butt, long 70cm (4 euros);
B) tip 0,8/2,4 long 50cm (6 euros because I bought it in a different shop);
C) tip 0,9/4,5 long 90cm (5,5 euro);
D) rod solid carbon diameter 4mm long 1 meter (5,5 euro).
You can find the tips solid carbon everywhere, in Italy I found them in all the fishing shop of my town. Maybe everybody hasn't all the measures, but I didn't need buy them on internet.
But in case in Italy you find them here http://www.tatfishing.com/nsct.html
The solid carbon rod is available in model shops: I found it in a model shop in my town, but in case on the net are easy to find http://www.eolomodellismo.it/oscommerce ... =2a&page=2

I cut the C tip to obtain a second piece long 42cm and diameter of the tip 2,45mm, butt 4mm, to interconnect the tips with the rod, the butt.
To connect the tip to the second piece and the second piece to the butt I used as ferrules pieces of regular rods, refuses, that the fishing shopkeepers use to make repairs, that they donated me (I donated to one of them, the more patient and generous, a bottle of wine...).

And now some numbers:

I was looking for a short rod, 5 feet or a little more, for a line #2 and a pure 6,6 #1 and even a real rod for lines #0/#1.
I made some measures using the same configuration but simulating to cut the butt in different measures.

First configuration: Butt 0,4, second piece and tip A
full lenght 215cm, ern 0,65, AA 71;
195 cm, ern 0,8, AA 74;
170 cm, ern 0,8, AA 74;
150 cm, ern 0,8, AA 74.
As you can see with a tip very "soft" the influence of the tip in the different length doesn't change the action of the rod, who remains very fast, and neither the ern.
The weight of the blanks in the full length is 27 grams, then very light.

Second configuration: butt 0,4, second piece and tip B:
full lenght195cm, ern 1,15, AA 58;
170cm, ern 1,50, AA 60;
150 cm, ern 2,30, AA 63.
Here the tip is more rigid and influence a lot more the action of the rod, who is less fast. Then changing the length change both, action and ern.

But anyway I found this material very very interesting: for example if somebody wish make an ultralight long rod, 10 feet or even more, it's sufficient use a couple of rods and one tip to obtain an ultralight long rod for a really little investment.
The look is fantastic: ultra thin!

The more difficult operation is find the correct ferrule, bur after few attempts everybody can find it.

I think that for ultralight fly fishers this material is really the best and with a single butt and intermediate piece you can change different tips in different situations for really a little investment.

I can't wait to build a rod to try it, but for the moment enjoy :)

Roberto


Last edited by zigo on Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
  
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:30 am • # 2 
User avatar
Sr. Member

Joined: 07/25/13
Posts: 323
Location: Southern NH
Can you post some pictures?
I'd like to see how you did the ferrules, especially.


Top
  
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 2:46 pm • # 3 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
This is the ferrule on the tip: this is the easiest because tip and second piece are both tapered.

Image

These are other potential ferrules

Image

Between the second piece and the butt things are not so easy because one piece is tapered, the other is cylindrical. For the moment I resolved the problem with an interim solution who allowed me to measure the rods, using just a few rounds of tape. It's not so rigid like the carbon and adapted without problems the butt eliminating the gap of a few hundredths of a millimeter, due to different profile. But I'm planning to try other more definitive solutions and better look, like sand a little the tip of the butt.


Top
  
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 8:45 pm • # 4 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
zigo wrote:
C) tip 0,9/4,5 long 90cm (5,5 euro);

I cut the C tip to obtain a second piece long 42cm and diameter of the tip 2,45mm, butt 4mm, to interconnect the tips with the rod, the butt.


Using the tip of the C, who remained after that I cut the second piece, I obtained other actions rods.
E) The tip is 39cm long/0,9mm tip/2,5mm butt:
Total lenght 184cm/ 1,68 ern/ AA52
170cm/ 2,15 ern/ 57 AA;
150cm/ 3,05/ 63AA.
A tip shorter and 1 dec of mm larger in the butt and, more important, larger in the tip change totally the results and the action: the rod is a lot slower and more powerful. The rolled carbon blanks on the market can't be smaller that 1,2mm (3/64 inch). I think this is the principal reason because ultralight rolled blanks usually can't be used with less that #1 lines and usually are not too fast.
Using solid carbon these limits are largely exceeded, because solid carbon is stronger that rolled, and thinner and longer tips consent ern a lot lower, in the #0 lines range and eventually even lower, and a lot faster actions.

I wanted make a full solid carbon rod, using even a solid carbon butt, but it's not necessary: I made some experiments with hybrid solutions: tips solid carbon, second piece and butt tapered rolled carbon, or tip and second piece solid carbon and butt rolled tapered carbon and the results are anyway very interestings and I obtained perfectly useful blanks. Using tapered butts, in addition, find ferrules is even a lot easiest.

Another very interesting way to use solid carbon tips, in fact, is use them on your rods to obtain different rods with different characteristics for different situations.
Using only solid carbon tips or tips and second piece is a lot easier adapt them to your rods, using the same butt or butt and second piece or third, in case of multi-piece rods.

For Example, I have a Pacific Bay 793-2 that I cut the butt obtaining a 6,6 #2. The butt is 78 cm long and the size of the butt's tip is 4,28 mm.
In this case I used as second piece a tapered rolled carbon piece 58cm long, 2,49mm tip, 4,28 mm butt (that a shopper donated me because it was a refuse cut to make a new tip).
In this case I obtained:
using the A tip a 205cm rod/ 0,95 ern/ 76 AA;
using the B a 187cm rod/ 2,3 ern/ 68 AA;
using the E tip a 160cm/ 4,10 ern/ 64 AA.

In this case with an investment of about 15 euros I obtained 3 new tips for my usual rod and I have 4 rods for 4 totally different situations.

(work in progress)


Last edited by zigo on Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
  
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2015 9:34 pm • # 5 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
zigo wrote:
This is the ferrule on the tip: this is the easiest because tip and second piece are both tapered.

These are other potential ferrules

Between the second piece and the butt things are not so easy because one piece is tapered, the other is cylindrical. For the moment I resolved the problem with an interim solution who allowed me to measure the rods, using just a few rounds of tape. It's not so rigid like the carbon and adapted without problems the butt eliminating the gap of a few hundredths of a millimeter, due to different profile. But I'm planning to try other more definitive solutions and better look, like sand a little the tip of the butt.


I quote myself to say: the pieces that I used to make the ferrule I have seen that larger they are, weaker they are. I mean, the smaller diameter are stronger that the larger. For these reasons I think to cover them with the thread that I will use for the rings and epoxy to strengthen them.


Top
  
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2015 2:42 am • # 6 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
And now (as Palecain asked) a step by step instructions to make it: it's easy, you need only the correct instruments to do it.

1) You need a caliper
Image

2) Or, a lot better, a micrometer. I think that the micrometer is indispensable for a fly fisherman who want understand better what he is doing. I use it to measure the leaders, the tippets and the lines too. I use it because often what is wrote by the manufacturers is not true and depending by the manufacturer the differences with the truth can be higher, they tend to write measures smaller that true and at the end you fish with tippets larger that what you think. I use a cheap one: I don't use it so much to justify a professional one. Like this:
http://www.amazon.it/Micrometro-Analogi ... micrometro

3) And you need a common hacksaw with a blade to cut iron
Image

4) Then to find the correct second piece you measure the tip of the butt
Image

5) And then you find a piece of rolled carbon tapered rod who measure in the butt a little less that the tip of the butt, for example 4,2mm if the tip of the butt is 4,3mm, and in the tip a little more that the butt of the tip, 2,5mm if the butt of the tip is 2,4mm. Obviously is pretty impossible find a piece of rod so perfect, usually it's larger in the butt and smaller in the tip: you measure it with the micrometer and then you cut the excess with the hacksaw. Use the hacksaw not too fast, to don't overheat the carbon...but with hand saw it's really difficult. To find the correct second place you can ask to your preferred fishing shop keeper, like I did or buy one of these http://www.tatfishing.com/kcim,-elct,-34c.html
Image

6) Once you have the second piece you need the ferrules to connect the tip to the second piece and the second piece to the butt.
You take another piece of tapered rolled carbon (the shop keeper is very useful in this case too or you need again http://www.tatfishing.com/kcim,-elct,-34c.html ).
Image

7) You see if the tip of the second piece enter in the larger part of the ferrule and in case you cut it since it's perfect to block the tip of the second piece inside the ferrule about 2,5cm.
Image

8) (- this was an 8 with the )...but it's right even so :) )Then you try to insert the tip inside the ferrule: if it block about 2,5cm of the butt of the tip inside you are lucky, if it block it before you need cut the smaller part of the ferrule since it's perfect. Often find the perfect ferrules is not so easy: the more important is that it's perfect for the tip of the second piece, because it will be the part that you will detach and attach all the times that you will go fishing. If the butt of the tip is even not perfect and the ferrule is a little large, I put a small piece of tape on it to block it perfectly. And it will be fixed with epoxy.
Image

Image

Image

Image

Image

For the ferrule between the butt and the second piece you do the same.

(Using this process you can, I think, make a 4 piece rod from a 2 piece too, for example.)

I plan, as I wrote before, to cover the ferrules with thread and then epoxy, to reinforce them.
As you see it's not difficult, the more difficult is find a shop keeper or a rods repairer patient who helps you. And a bottle of wine or a piece of cheese in this cases can help :)

2 notes:
- instead of rolled carbon tapered rod for the second piece can be used solid carbon, like in the first post of this thread: this change the action. In fact for equal diameters solid carbon is more strong that rolled carbon (I will publish how ern and AA change in this case);
- I have seen that the tip of the butts in professional rods are solid, not empty (like a spigot). I think that the possible reason is that in that point the rod can break, because the ferrule stops the curvature of the rod and at that point is more stressed. I don't know, I will try. If more expert that me have something to counsel are well accepted and I'm grateful to accept any counsel about. It's obvious that using solid carbon instead of rolled this problem is avoided or by sure a lot moderated.

Roberto


Top
  
PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2015 7:42 am • # 7 
User avatar
Full Member

Joined: 01/19/12
Posts: 204
Location: Italy
I reply myself to the second of the 2 notes above: this can be a good solution.

http://spazioinwind.libero.it/voloinpen ... netta.html


Top
  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  

  Page 1 of 1   [ 7 posts ] New Topic Add Reply

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


- OurBoard Support -