It is currently Fri Jun 18, 2021 7:30 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




  Page 1 of 1   [ 8 posts ] New Topic Add Reply
Author Message
 Post subject: Bail-less spinning reels
PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2017 12:44 am • # 1 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 11/20/08
Posts: 591
I've been reading a lot about spinning reels without bails.

Pros/Cons?

Just a fad or does it make sense?


Top
  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2017 4:36 pm • # 2 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 11/19/08
Posts: 1162
Location: Fayetteville, NC
Bails were invented because some fishermen (maybe most) weren't paying attention to their line and lures. They'd be walking along a stream and discover that their lure was 50 yds behind them in a bush, or they'd be in a boat and pick up their rod to cast, only most of their line was a tangled mess in the water behind them. Early bails served only to minimize this problem. The next step in the evolution of the spinning reel is what caused the problem—automatically-closing bails. As the spool rotates to reach the spot where the mechanism closes it, line makes a half twist, more or less. Over the course of a couple of hundred casts, those twists add up. They are especially harmful to thin lines (1-6 lb test), and they cause something that makes a baitcaster's bird's nest look tame by comparison.

You can avoid the problem by either cutting off the bail wire and going back to the old method of using your finger to move the line on and off the roller, or you can control the line with your finger and open/close the bail by hand. Either works, I can't see any practical difference in the results. Cutting the bails off classic UL reels (like Alcedo Microns) does carry with it an air of expertise that you may or may not want to cultivate.... :lol


Top
  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2017 8:15 pm • # 3 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 08/31/15
Posts: 982
Location: Coppell, TX
Bail less spinning reels make more sense than spinning reels with bails. I started removing the bail when I was young and
couldn't afford replacements, but I discovered many advantages as I developed expertise:
1. Silence! No sound of the bail closing and that was a real advantage in the small marsh pools I was fishing.
2. Line Control!. As I lifted the line with my finger from the pick up roller and released the line the finger was in position to feather the line for accurate casts; very important in small water fishing.
3. Line Twists! Eliminated line twists


Top
  
PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2017 10:35 pm • # 4 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 08/27/15
Posts: 781
Location: New Jersey
I can see merit in going bail-less but I don't see how it changes line twist. Level wind baitcast reels put no twist in the line since it comes straight off the spool. But anytime you wind line from the end of a spool you put twist into it. If you've ever coiled a long power cord or rope, you've seen how terribly twisted it gets. Each wrap adds one full twist (or is it a half twist, I forget). To me a spinning reel does the same thing, bail or not.

PS: There's a way to hand coil cords and rope that eliminates twist. If anyone is interested I can try to explain.


Top
  
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 8:40 pm • # 5 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 08/31/15
Posts: 982
Location: Coppell, TX
Maybe someone can explain it, I can't. I've been told the bail causes line twist and I never experience line twist fishing bail-less so I assumed.....
Anyone?


Top
  
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 9:27 pm • # 6 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 11/19/08
Posts: 1162
Location: Fayetteville, NC
As the bail closes, it also rotates. It's the time the line spends going from the pick up contact point on the bail to the roller that introduces extra twist. It's actually sliding along the length of the bail before it lands in the pick up roller to begin rotating around the spool.

In a perfect scenario, spinning line has been spooled from the side with no twist (in the real world, you can't load line from the end of the spool it was sold on to the reel's spool without twist because the two spools are always of differing diameters).... Anyhow, the line is on the reel's spool with no twist because it was loaded perfectly in our scenario. Then it's cast, introducing one twist for every turn around the spool.

So, the cast line has exactly the same number of twists in it as the number of revolutions it made around the spool. When you retrieve, those twists will cancel each other out, laying the line untwisted and relaxed back on the spool. By using a self-closing bail, you will introduce a half twist to the line every time you cast, because of that bail rotation as it picks up the line before closing and transferring the line to the pick up roller. Over the course of a day, or week or ever how long it takes you to make a hundred casts, you've developed a mess of "extra" half twists. Picking the line up with your finger and placing it on the roller before you start reeling eliminates those half twists.

In the real world, fishermen introduce extra line twist in a number of ways, such as fishing in-line spinners with inadequate (they're all inadequate) or no swivels. But still and all, manual pick up of spinning line is the best method, whether or not you keep your bail.


Last edited by Cross Creek on Tue Jul 25, 2017 7:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
  
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:35 am • # 7 
User avatar
Hero Member

Joined: 11/20/08
Posts: 591
Thanks for the comments.

I resurrected an old Shimano AX UL-S reel that I had laying around for my new Micro Light rod.

Before I cut the bail off, I think I'll try and work on using my index finger to pick up the line.


Top
  
PostPosted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:53 pm • # 8 
User avatar
Newbie

Joined: 11/12/17
Posts: 19
There is some great insight here, thanks. I recently discovered the Shakespeare 2200 (not the II), and it is a great candidate to convert to bail-less. About 7 ounces, inexpensive, SEALED bearings, made in Japan, and cleans up nice. Tight lines!


Top
  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  

  Page 1 of 1   [ 8 posts ] New Topic Add Reply

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group

- OurBoard Support -